Generation
Forgetting how courtship works doesn't help anyone
By: Marianne Brennan
Posted: 3/29/07
Whatever happened to the date? You know, guy meets girl, guy asks girl to dinner and a movie. I've heard stories about such things from old people: stories about getting picked up at your front door and taken to a restaurant that specializes in something other than hot wings and the $2 domestic brews. Stories about men who offered to pay for your movie ticket. Stories about men who don't screw around with vague invitations to "hang out sometime."So the question is, where have these men gone? Any college girl can tell you that the rules have changed since our parents were in school. The concept of a mature dating relationship seems beyond the grasp of our generation. We either attach ourselves to a single person in a comfortable pseudo-marriage that lasts all four years of college, or wander aimlessly from bar to bar and keg party to keg party, where we hook up for the night and go our separate ways in the morning.
The lack of dating on college campuses isn't an isolated phenomenon. Rather, it's a symptom of a generational flaw that has us growing up and taking responsibility later than our parents did.The non-committal "do you want to hang out sometime" is really the dating equivalent of how we approach our lives. The media have recently taken great delight in pointing out that college students are moving back in with their parents after graduation, receiving more financial assistance and delaying everything from choosing a major to getting married.
We've grown up with the expectation that we will go to college; for most of us, there was no doubt that our post-high school plans would include college. And our sense of expectation and entitlement has turned college into an extension of childhood, rather than a path to adulthood.But why does it even matter that we don't date anymore?
Who cares that we aren't following the same rules our parents and grandparents did?In our eagerness to leave old norms and rules behind us, we've forgotten that these rules had purposes. Courtship in the sense of traditional dating meant that women didn't have to spend so much time wondering what exactly that guy meant when he asked if she wanted to hang out sometime. Social rules create greater clarity of intent.
Likewise, we've ignored the conventional wisdom that graduating from college means becoming
an independent adult. Increasingly, graduates are moving back in with their parents and clinging to their semi-dependent lifestyles.College dating is practice for adult relationships.So, if we forgo dating in favor of a few drunken hook-ups and stalking our crushes on Facebook, how are we going to fare once we are forced out of the baby pool that is college and make our delayed entry into the real world?Asking someone to go out with you is incredibly nerve-wracking. You risk rejection and possible humiliation. But part of growing up is learning to do the things you're afraid of.
Remember when you went to the library as a little kid and were afraid to ask the librarian a question, but your mother made you do it anyway? Eventually, you got used to asking questions and taking your books to the counter yourself. By forcing you to take initiative, your mom taught you to be a little more independent.
Every time you ask someone if he or she wants to "hang out sometime," or try to convince him or her to go out with you without using the word date and without making it clear that your intentions are romantic, you are doing the dating equivalent of handing your books to you mom and making her talk to the librarian.
The anxiety that comes with asking someone out is nothing new, nor is the fact that we miss opportunities due to our own fear. What is new is the fact that we have created watered-down alternatives that we convince ourselves are just as good as what our parents and grandparents had.We are content to just drift along in an easy pattern, demanding nothing from ourselves. We accept mediocrity and inertia with the same ease that we accept hanging out sometime as a substitute for dating.
12 comments:
i've only had one boyfriend that got away with the whole "let's hang out." he was also a major cheap a** and lazy bones, which i discovered when we dated. (and yet incredibly charming) hence, i think he was incapable of actually executing a proper date.
all my other boyfriends have asked me out on proper dates. so, i don't think it is just a generational thing. i find when guys i know just want to hang out, they usually just want to be my friend. if they're really interested, they invest time and make a plan (regardless of the cost of the date).
my take, not bitter or good points. she just isn't setting high enough standards. if you expect a guy to date you, then don't settle for a hang out. if you're cool with a casual hang out that leads to make out that leads to dating, then kudos to you too! okay, this is long. i'll end this now.
(but do post your opinions. i'm interested)
I tend to agree with aisy. I think that if a guy likes you enough, he will try to take you out and impress you. Yes, guys still do this. :) I've used both the "date" and the "hang out". Hang out is if I just want to test the waters before asking you out and maybe doing some hooking up without the commitment and work that a date involves. But it can also mean, as I have used it, I like you, but I can't date you right now due to any of the following; I have a gf, I'm not looking for a gf, I'm leaving/starting a new time in my life/can't be bothered with a girl soon. Sometimes it is personal, sometimes it's "me, not you". :)
But I also think the author has a point, we all assume we have 4+ years of more non-responsibility and plenty of time to find "the one", so why rush to "grow up" and date responsible?!? When all our parents were getting married at 18-24, it was b/c there was nothing else going on and if you didn't, the sea was pretty lonely being 24 and single. Now it is the norm. The need just does not exist anymore. This will only continue to drag out generation after generation as the age we marry continues to increase respectively.
i really liked her library analogy - good one. hanging out can be distracting and keep us from doing that dating that we do when we're really interested. didn't some conference talk say don't let good things distract you from doing essential things?
oh, and i'm a fan of rules. rules provide clarity and social graces which allow people to feel comfortable and safe. call me a high school teacher, but rules make the world go round. it sounds like dating provides some necessary rules.
Hang Outs and Real Dates... okay, actually, I think you need BOTH. Just one with out the other is no good. For instance, my boyfriend and I really ONLY do very official dates... because we don't live in the same freaking STATE and so we have to REALLY plan things to be together. They are fun (he is very splurgey)... BUT... I actually want to just hang out sometimes. Like just a casual, hey come over, we'll talk, chill, or do nothing. I want THOSE too. Because you need to see both sides, you know? I want to really REALLY know the guy I eventually marry, and that means dating... but also the more "real" hanging out.
That's my 2 cents.
I've thought about this a lot. I even had a talk with my boyfriend about it cuz we never really dated, just hung out. It was sorta sucky not to get "the treatment"...but then again I got to know him a whole hellofalot better a whole hellofalot faster. So I guess the jury is still out.
ummm...but this is an awesome SJ IN THE CITY topic
Kip--what everyone is talking about when you first meet someone. Its traditional date--after you've dated for a certain amount of time, then you hang out of course. You spend more time that isn't dating per se, but getting to know each other etc in a day to day setting.
Personally, I've done the dating thing, just the hangout and the makeout buddy thing. Dating works for me when I start a relationship. Makeout buddies? There's a reason the LDS church says no sex before marriage and if you're making out with someone--it should be in a relationship -preferably one that's going somewhere. That's something I've learned by trial and error however.
I think Aisy is right when she says that if you expect a guy to date you-don't settle for a makeout.
I don't think this girl is bitter per se, but I do think she's seeing behavior and misappropriately labeling it.
I don't think hanging out is a generational flaw per se.
amen sherpa. i agree wholeheartedly with that. i get tired of generational overstatments that i don't think are completely accurate. i agree that we hang out more than our parents etc but that does not mean we don't also still date.
All I know is that the hanging out was more stressful for me than dating!
My relationship with my first husband started out as hanging out as he was often a sparring coach at the gym. And I hated so much wondering if he liked me or not. Needless to say, we had communication problems from the start.
When I met my current (and permanent, thank you!) husband, he was very formal about asking me out on "dates" and his intentions were clear. My intentions were clear by accepting his invitation every time.
So I think I preferred dating because his intentions and my intentions were clearly for the purpose of courtship, and not wondering every day if we're hanging out because we're friends or if we're hanging out because he might like me. Does that make sense?
in my expereince, hanging out as a way to start a relationship is pretty risky and definitely decreases your chance of having mutual respect in the relationship.
it may be a good way to get to "know" somebody, but there's usually plenty of time for that later, after you have established that the guy thinks you are worth the effort required.
on the other hand there's nothing wrong with hanging out with friends even ones you might potentially be interested in, but i think it is pretty much always better (if you are interested) to make the transition to dating firmly.
i do agree that our youth has been extended a bit and maybe even that we are not as used to making decisions--because most people go to college so it's already decided for you and most people change their jobs a bunch so you don't have to settle on one career, etc., but i don't think that people are not capable of dating. i think they will certainly make the effort when they are genuinely interested. some, though, might need a little nudge. maybe a little "when do you plan on asking me out?" (as long as you make it sound good-natured, cute, funny, etc. and not like an accusation).
I think it is part of/becoming a bit of a generational flaw, and it's like a moving ship that is hard to turn around or stop. I don't think it is necessarily inherently bad, you can weed out guys you don't like pretty fast by hanging out with them a time or two. This being said when occasion arises to give a guy friend or my brother advice I say hey, take the girl on a "real date" and you will probably have a better chance with her!
aisy hit the bullseye. I can't believe I'm saying this, but women, since they accept or reject a man's advances, truly have the power in a relationship. If women rejected any offer to hang out, then men would quickly get the hint that they need to try a little harder, not be so lazy and cheap, and plan a real, honest-to-goodness date. Don't settle! If anything, you'll help us rise up from the dust and be men!
Um, when do dudes "offer to hang out"? In college, guys would just come over to my apartment all the time without asking and it really bothered me because it meant they didn't respect my time. The whole point of the hang out is there is no opportunity for rejection. There's no OFFER to hang out, and you can't really reject them once they're there. I guess I could have refused them entry to the apartment, but that would have felt rude. They usually got the picture when I left them sitting on my sofa for with a guy that had actually managed to a) PLAN a date and b) ASK ME c) IN ADVANCE.
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